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Author Topic: Outline of my main stories/questlines  (Read 4504 times)
laclongquan
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« on: January 26, 2011, 03:31:04 PM »

The main idea:

The survival and migration of several tribal communities in northern lands. Their settlement in southern lands, with better chance for survival.

The restart of sea trade in Baltic. One major port in southern coast, repair one major sea vessel (freighter?), farming lands in Europe with a bit of surplus. Linking those above communities with the trade: food go north, goods go south. Flourish a bit for both of them.

Your character is NOT going out to save the world. (s)He travel to find and reunite with his/her lost family members due to scavengers/slavers' attack. The search lead to several tribal communities in the north, find one. The other clue lead to some big village in the south, maybe a port. Chase to the port to discover (s)he was traded oversea. Repair a vessels and gather some helping hands to travel across Baltic to Europe. Find that final family member

The 1st family member settled in one of tribal communities in the north but they all worried that games are moving south. You help one/all of them settle in the south successfully. Even find some special things that they can create/scavenge in the ruin to be trade goods.

The second family member marry one of the shipmate and decide to stay with the sea trader'slife. You link both the communities and the seatraders.

Context: You are living in the aftermath of Nuclear Winter (3-7 years after the final weapon detonate. People are scared of increasing cold but the Nuclear Winter'endstage will stop after 5 years. It will get warmer. The cold also explain why the extreme difficulties in agriculture.

Context: Denmark control the mouth of Baltic so it will be destroyed utterly in the war. Due to the ferocious attacks, people fear and avoid go to south.

I repeat that there shall be no mention of prophecy, Chosen One, or Saving the World of any kind. You *accidentally* save the world in the course of saving your family and take care of them. It's not cool? It's realistic and believable.
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rowanthepreacher
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« Reply #1 on: January 26, 2011, 04:38:40 PM »

I'll pass. It seems a bit... game-y to be searching for a long lost relative and it's been done ad nauseum.

To expand upon this, I'd like to begin at the end, with accidentally saving the world (well...). In your story, it appears that purely by existing, you've linked the two communities. At first, this seems reasonable, but it's unlikely that an entire community will join hands with a completely different, strange and unknown community just because one of the members has links to someone else who in turn has links to a member of the second community. That would be like Russia and Afghanistan forming a diplomatic union because some of Osama Bin Laden's family live in Texas.

Furthermore, with the lack of oil and general state of things following WWIII, it's as unlikely that sea traders exist as it is that there's a chapter of the Hell's Angels rolling about in the frozen north. The delicate balance of aquatic life means that fishing would be almost impossible out to sea, given radioactive fallout and the sudden decrease in temperatures.

I do like the idea of sailing to other lands, perhaps as a sort of side-area available once you have suitable transport and a source of fuel, but I can't really see you travelling anywhere further than the Shetland islands.
« Last Edit: January 26, 2011, 09:32:00 PM by rowanthepreacher » Logged

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zenbitz
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« Reply #2 on: January 26, 2011, 10:19:06 PM »

I like the concept of accidentally doing something good, but the details are not that compelling.


It seems that you are changing stuff from the http://wiki.parpg.net/Setting and http://wiki.parpg.net/Creative_vision for no real good reason.

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laclongquan
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« Reply #3 on: January 27, 2011, 07:52:05 AM »

Chosen Ones and Prophesized Hero Saving the World has been done to DEATH. Finding your relatives, though, I dont think it been used that often.

Tell me 3 games that use finding relatives?
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Gaspard
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« Reply #4 on: January 27, 2011, 10:27:38 AM »

Well, we can start with
a) Fallout 3
b) Baldur's Gate 2

In both games it was kind of 'optional' to look for them, but that just meant dialogue options where you say you don't care about that family member and are looking for them for whatever other reason.

If I think some more, I'm sure I'll come up with number three and then a few more - these two just happen to be of the RPG genre, Fallout 3 being a PA RPG

Last but not least - this stuff has been done in fiction time and time again, while there it might work, in the game that we're trying to make PARPG into it would not work - for starters because that's a bit too much railroading:
1) it already expects the player to give a fuck about the relatives, if not full-blown care about them
2) it says the player character has relatives - we're running into a problem when the player would like to play a loner with no family or any close people at all
3)
Quote
I repeat that there shall be no mention of prophecy, Chosen One, or Saving the World of any kind. You *accidentally* save the world in the course of saving your family and take care of them. It's not cool? It's realistic and believable.
I'm sorry, but are you saying that "you're not going to save the world, but you're going to save the world" ? õ_õ

EDIT: but as a backstory for an NPC character it could work fine - such as optional side quests etc
« Last Edit: January 27, 2011, 10:30:50 AM by Gaspard » Logged
laclongquan
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« Reply #5 on: January 30, 2011, 02:30:21 PM »

tsk! Fallout 3 kinda queer the deal. I would like to use F3 as a weighty reason, but frankly I never play it and dont like it much, so oh well.

BG2 is actually not about finding your relative(s), believe or not.

And the idea that players wanting to play loner is a factor. True, some just dont want any tie at all so that they can kill everyone.  Undecided

The idea of "accidentally save the world" is to counteract the cliched idea of "prophesized hero save the world". You, as a character,  actually dont give a shit about save the world. As a loner, or a social character, dont matter. It's a concept only exist in bad novels and games and anime. But you could accidentally doing so while you do the normal things, like hunting for your relatives, hunting for your enemies, or making big bucks.

Your character need a reason to wandering all over the howling wilderness that is scandinavian winter lands. Excuse me, that's no pleasure trek. You  need a compelling reason to do so. Survival? You could just settle in a community south of where you start, warmer and easier. Make a living? Why not in the south. But Vengeance or Finding Relatives, that's a strong reason to do so. People understand that. People snigger at some noname nobody who want to save the world while wandering the wilderness.

And due to the difference of living conditions, there exist a strong and clear distinction between vagabond/wanderer/hunter and community dweller/farmers. There are so, belive or not. And you need to bridge that difference, that distrust between two sides to link them. You need to make it so foods can be imported from the continent, and goods go back to pay for it. But strong trade can only exist on trust, on a social contract that when I trade you a freighter ship full of wheat you will give back me goods of equivalent value and not kill me. How do you do it? That's  when a third party with strong link to both sides come in: You, who have brothers and sisters in both.

There's a compelling reasons for brothers and sisters all over the place.

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Gaspard
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« Reply #6 on: January 30, 2011, 03:04:14 PM »

There's a compelling reasons for brothers and sisters all over the place.

Well, I'm an only child - it is very hard for me to sympathize.

Quote
And the idea that players wanting to play loner is a factor. True, some just dont want any tie at all so that they can kill everyone.

Having no ties does not mean I want to kill everybody, it doesn't even mean I'd want to kill abybody or kill at all - it can man that I might not want to care about anybody but myself.
If I had survived the WW3 I'm not sure I would care any more if some stupid gangbangers kill my partner - I might accept that as part of the horror the cruel world had become and thus give up on any thoughts of vengeance because I might not see the point õ_õ
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rowanthepreacher
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« Reply #7 on: January 30, 2011, 03:19:37 PM »

Gaspard, being an only child doesn't change your perspective on family as far as I'm aware. I've experienced having siblings as well as basically being an only child, and i prefer the latter, while others with no siblings wish they could have some.

Also, you must be a very mellow person. If someone did anything to anyone I cared about in a post apocalyptic setting, I would take full advantage of the lawlessness to wreak bloody vengeance.

I agree with your position, but not with the arguments you used.

Laclon:
How much familial ties matter to each person varies widely and in a sandbox game, forcing the player to complete a quest he really couldn't care less about is a very bad idea. "accidentally saving the world" is about as cliched as "chosen one", in my opinion.

The struggle for survival, as the winter bears down upon you is a very compelling reason to trek. The survival instinct and the urge to discover are intrinsic parts of (almost) every human, what more universal or understood reasons could we give? Anything else is going to feel right to some people and wrong to others, and to those people for whom it is not compelling, the game will essentially have no purpose. No-one reads a boring novel, nor would they play a game without a plot they can relate to on some level.
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laclongquan
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« Reply #8 on: January 31, 2011, 12:40:14 PM »

1st, Why "accidentally saving the world" is a cliche? As far as I know, no game ever used it. I cant say for every game, of course, but from what I know it's pretty unique idea. If you say it's a cliche, at least name some games use that.

2nd, There's always a reason behind a wandering lifestyle. Some tribes in Scandinavia live on reindeer herds so they must go along with the herds, that's why they move from one region to another. Some minority tribes in the tropical wandering to new region every few years because their slash-and-burn farming method exhaust the soil and force they move. But without compelling economic/survival reasons, no community/person move about much. Why? Because stay put make defending your area where you make a living (hunting, gathering, or farming) much easier. With advanced farming techniques, there's absolutely no reason to move and many good reasons to stay in one area.

To give one concrete example about one dont move much in winter/cold climate: Warmth. You want to gather a lot of firewoods plus foods and stay in a place out of winds. Move outside require many warm clothes, foods, very much more than the requirement of one stay put.
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