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Author Topic: music themes/locations - likantropika music cooperation  (Read 5070 times)
qubodup
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« on: June 03, 2009, 03:03:54 PM »

likantropika [internet archive | jamendo | myspace | vimeo] likes parpg and agrees to the gpl3/ccbysa3 licensing. [mail communication | I mentioned this before]

They would like concept art and brainstorming/ideas for music.

List of Ambient Music in Fan Made Fallout is a great list of short music descriptions (which so nicely fit our theme) and I was hoping that you could describe scenes and moods, that could be turned into music for parpg or even write concrete music composition ideas.. This is a brainstorming thread, so don't worry too much Wink

Also, we need to put (or at least link) the existing concept art in once place. I will start a thread on that topic in the graphics subforum. EDIT: Here's the concept art now.
« Last Edit: June 18, 2009, 02:26:15 PM by qubodup » Logged
qubodup
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« Reply #1 on: June 18, 2009, 02:26:00 PM »

So here's some location descriptions for inspiration: (One thing to know: We're in a post apocalyptic snow scenario in north/north-east europe.)

1. Small village built around a stranded nuclear submarine, that is being used as energy resource. [discussion] [concept art]

2. Nuclear shelter metro from http://forums.parpg.net/index.php?topic=198.0 :
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5) Although there are no subways in ELL (in Kaliningrad either), you may have heard that USSR/Russia are notorious for their metropolitan, designed as the antinuclear bombshelters (exactly like the vaults in Fallout), do you think it might be appropriate for us to introduce them in the game nonetheless?

3. Radioactive shroom plantation cave (loosely based on http://forums.parpg.net/index.php?topic=180.msg2405#msg2405 ):
Radioactive dust affected a mushroom kind and now it makes the eyes glow after ingestion.
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Dave Matney
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« Reply #2 on: June 18, 2009, 08:10:13 PM »

It's really hard to determine the mood of a location without knowing what that location will be for in the story.  If the Submarine town is intended as a safehaven for us to buy stuff and rest, but we write incredibly depressing music for it, the player will instinctively avoid it, and perhaps miss key points because of location aversion. Or if we write something that's agressive, the player will be constantly looking for a fight in an otherwise peaceful location.

I do encourage every composer to get involved in the forums, and IRC if they can, to get a feel for the game as early as possible, but right now I don't think there's a lot of work that composers can realistically do and have it be congruent to the overall game.

One thing that will be difficult with a handful of composers will be an overall sense of every musical piece fitting the sound spectrum.  We can do it; it's been done before in music, and it's really similar to visual artists working together, but communication between composers is a big deal.  I don't know how many indie games I've played where the music doesn't flow well from level to level, even with the same composer.  I, for one, don't want this game to fall into the "it's only indie" mentality, especially in an area that can make or break a game.

Though it's exactly opposite of what I've said before, I'm starting to feel like developing music without story, or at least maps, is putting the cart before the horse.

In any case, I welcome Likantropika to the game, and I hope we can all work together. Smiley
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qubodup
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« Reply #3 on: June 19, 2009, 12:42:18 PM »

I think the 'emotion' music should carry is 'dark-potentially-dangerous'. PARPG is supposed to be free regarding choice of action, so the music has to fit, whether the player rests and trades or has slaughtered everyone. - I think this is how it was done for Fallout1/2 and I like the soundtrack end results. (Except the soundtrack of Modoc in Fallout 2 - "Dream Town" - which does not follow that style route and was 'melancholic', which is very unfitting.)
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meinmartini
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« Reply #4 on: June 19, 2009, 04:02:11 PM »

We're also discussing the quantity of music for the game. If this is going to be a game which follows specific types of moods, how many tracks are we talking here? That's an awful lot of music...
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tie
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« Reply #5 on: June 22, 2009, 09:02:33 AM »

I think survival punk would fit perfectly into the game. If such a style existed that is Smiley
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Gaspard
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« Reply #6 on: June 22, 2009, 10:09:56 AM »

Survival Punk could be the genre of the game ! There's Steam Punk, there's Cyberpunk, why not a PA setting that's Survival Punk =?
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tie
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« Reply #7 on: June 22, 2009, 10:54:49 AM »

OK, on a more serious note... A much as I'd like to have punk it the game, it would be hard to fit it in the overall atmosphere.

For a brutal survival RPG I imagine something dark and repetitive - Apocalyptica, Evenescence nad Lacrimosa come to mind. Some sample http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qzqybMSKi4I

I imagine the 'lighthearted' parts also being quite repetitieve and slightly twisted:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=T5Xl0Qry-hA
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aagavbw7keU
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Gaspard
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« Reply #8 on: June 22, 2009, 11:07:38 AM »

While reading at the forums or thinking about the PARPG project or drawing themed stuff I've been listening to Tim Hecker's Radio Amor. Pure Ambient, it has really set the mood for me. The song Azure Azure for example. Pretty much white noise tho
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shevegen
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« Reply #9 on: August 31, 2009, 05:44:01 PM »

I just realized this thread here Smiley

Bit old but hey...

Quote
It's really hard to determine the mood of a location without knowing what that location will be for in the story.
I guess this is true. I just like to picture a general somewhat dark, gloomy theme, with slight variations perhap - i .e. a bigger settlement might be better for the mood of the actor (and the other NPCs) and the music could be friendlier. In slightly subtle ways.

Quote
If the Submarine town is intended as a safehaven for us to buy stuff and rest, but we write incredibly depressing music for it, the player will instinctively avoid it, and perhaps miss key points because of location aversion. Or if we write something that's agressive, the player will be constantly looking for a fight in an otherwise peaceful location.

I guess different players will behave differently, and have different tastes in music. For me, the favourite BAD example is the main intro theme of wesnoth. I hate that audio track so much that I disable ALL music of wesnoth (i do use sound effects though, they are less annoying).

I guess if music is slightly irritating, it is no big deal.
I recently saw the movie The Shining, directed by Stanley Kubrick ~1980

The music is simple, but very effectful. "Dont enter room 237" ... and of course when the kid stares at the door, the music starts... and makes you crazy Wink  I was very close to the TV, it was dark, and it did have some effect.

Such an atmosphere is great, although I would say the music is a bit annoying... I mean, it is not an epic soundtrack I would like to listen to over and over again for example. On Fallout the music was somewhat fitting too. It felt a bit like a constant wind through a desert...

Quote
I do encourage every composer to get involved in the forums, and IRC if they can, to get a feel for the game as early as possible, but right now I don't think there's a lot of work that composers can realistically do and have it be congruent to the overall game.

You sound guys need to push more Smiley
The graphics guy have it easier here, they post some pics and get instant feedback.
Not sure how the audio section could profit, i mean - a submarine town, if it gets realized, would require quite some effort. It is perhaps better to focus on something immediate, something for demo and stuff. The storyline can get improved lateron more readily I guess after an initial effort.

Quote
One thing that will be difficult with a handful of composers will be an overall sense of every musical piece fitting the sound spectrum.
Very true. Isn't there an old saying in designing user interfaces - too many designers using different ideas, lead to design efforts which bite each other, without being very consistent and fitting in the long run. And the more different designers on board, the harder it gets.

Also, I think you audio guys could push more on the story. I mean, the story part shouldn't be set in stone 100%. It needs to be flexible.

One example is The Junglebook. Louis Prima was singing as King Louie, and his team was dancing and moving through the studio back then. You can see footage of this on youtube. After the drawers saw it, they adapted their artwork to this dance and move - so in a way, the effort of Louis Prima influenced the story writers and especially drawing guys a lot. Just push forward!

Another example, this time I am trying to brainstorm - for example, the actor might find an old music theme as part of a side quest. The story could be expanded on and on, for example it could be a small settlement and it was nuked quickly. Not everything was destroyed equally, the actor finds some pieces which still function, like a cassette recorder or similar.
And he listens to some kind of music on it .... and et voila, the music is one composition of an artist here, which lateron was perhaps not too appropriate to be the main theme of the game, but very appropriate as part of a subplot. Wink

What i try to depict here is just examples to overcome any possible block in the audio section.

I think the only guy I noticed on IRC pushing forward some compositions was timong (was that the right nick? I already forgot), we get a lot of feedback from programming and graphics section as far as I can see, but the audio guys have it a bit more difficult. At least that was my impression, may be wrong of course.
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meinmartini
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« Reply #10 on: September 01, 2009, 05:16:12 AM »

shevegen:

You need to understand that some of us are being a little bit cautious. We don't know where this project is heading. As I've mentioned many times ad nauseum, there have been projects to which I have submitted a good chunk of the soundtrack, only to have it deteriorate. It's also been mentioned that it's hard to devise the type of music that's requested for each area without having any idea what type of atmosphere we'd be writing for. Yes, naturally, the general theme of the game is dark, but once we have some consistent showing of different areas, levels, and environments, not much is going to be produced musically.

I don't know how much of the story or environment design can be done to fit an ambient-style of music. If the effect is to be similar to Fallout, the picture you get from most ambient tracks can either be vague, or overkill. So what is the approach from here? Write a series of imagination-lulling pieces followed by imagination-overload tracks?

I'm not writing this to be hostile, I'm just curious.
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