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Author Topic: Call for action: Ground tiles  (Read 11435 times)
maximinus
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« on: May 11, 2009, 05:14:34 PM »

Firstly, let me say it's been great having a bunch of good artists adding content recently.

However, from your friendly local programming dept, what we'd really like to see is some plain old vanilla GROUND TILES. You know, the sort that every artist says of 'I can whip those up in minutes'  Shocked

At the moment, we have nice buildings, some starting NPC's, even simple objects are getting some TLC, but the ground still looks like hor summer weather. Some nice 'cold' (however you envisage that) tiles - ice, snow - whatever with some transitions tiles would, IMHO, suddenly make the current code look a lot like the game we are trying to make.

Respond here for more info if you need it. Thanks!
« Last Edit: May 11, 2009, 05:17:43 PM by mvBarracuda » Logged

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bored dude
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« Reply #1 on: May 11, 2009, 07:58:10 PM »

like that?

also i am a noob and can only do monkey work like tiles. so that was basically done without blender. is there some reason for using blender for tiles?

ah and the tex is from http://www.cgtextures.com/content.php?action=license
so it should be ok
« Last Edit: May 11, 2009, 08:38:09 PM by bored dude » Logged
bored dude
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« Reply #2 on: May 11, 2009, 09:09:08 PM »

ah wth...











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Dave Matney
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« Reply #3 on: May 11, 2009, 09:40:50 PM »

What about tiles larger than 1x1... Should they be broken down into 1x1 tiles, or are bigger tiles possible?
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Zimble
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« Reply #4 on: May 11, 2009, 10:07:11 PM »

Looks nice, bored dude. Thanks for the contribution. Help's always welcome.

One problem I see with your tiles is that they... urm... don't tile good. The repetitions are to obvious (@see attachment)

I'm not that much of a gfx guy, so maybe I'm totaly wrong and there are some tricks. Surely Sirren or one of the other guys can say more about this. Just wait until he pops in and has a look at them.


* Image7.jpg (17.43 KB, 340x180 - viewed 431 times.)
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Sirren
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« Reply #5 on: May 11, 2009, 11:20:28 PM »

Nope, sorry, I never made a tile in my life.
Continuum posted something about tile making at www.nma-fallout.com   If you don't know about this guy then please pay a visit to the modding forum @ NMA.

Amongst other stuff we'd need a tool to lay down HUGE chunks of tiles at once, provided that we want some variation. I'm talking about dirt/snow/ground tiles, not special stuff like pavements/roads you have to carefully place.
If it's simply to have a placeholder then a simple blurred blue/white tile could do.. Sorry, just a wild guess
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mvBarracuda
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« Reply #6 on: May 11, 2009, 11:26:36 PM »

Couldn't you use the tile creation guide that Lamoot posted at the wiki?

http://wiki.parpg.net/Graphics:Workflow_Simple_Tile
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Sirren
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« Reply #7 on: May 11, 2009, 11:43:15 PM »

Making a single tile isn't the point. The point is making a set of let's say 36 (6x6 square) tiles which can be put on the ground with some variation and that tile seamlessly. I'd try, I really don't know how to do it..
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eleazzaar
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« Reply #8 on: May 12, 2009, 12:32:35 AM »

Amongst other stuff we'd need a tool to lay down HUGE chunks of tiles at once, provided that we want some variation. I'm talking about dirt/snow/ground tiles, not special stuff like pavements/roads you have to carefully place.

It would be good to have the ability to lay down large chunks for special, man-made things, but you don't need that to make variation in most "noisy", natural surfaces.

You just make several variations that tile seamlessly with each other, and distribute them randomly.  If done properly this will look more irregular and natural than large chunks.

I just added a third grass tile that somehow got lost, that though they were done quickly should be enough to show how the small tile randomly distributed thing works.
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maximinus
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« Reply #9 on: May 12, 2009, 01:48:04 AM »

It would be good to have the ability to lay down large chunks for special, man-made things, but you don't need that to make variation in most "noisy", natural surfaces.

I'll add some code to the map loader so that it randomly distributes the grass tiles tonight and we'll see it looks like.

The FIFE map editor doesn't let you add 'large tiles' as such, so they have to pieced together one by one.

And bored dude, thanks for the work so far. They look OK to me.
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Sirren
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« Reply #10 on: May 12, 2009, 01:49:59 AM »

Ok, I found a way.
I made a grid which is 6x6 parpg tiles. Applied a square tilable texture. Sliced my grid in 36 smaller tiles. Animated the visibility of all tiles in an animated sequence of 36 frames (actually I'm doing so as I write.. it's almost 3 o'clock in the morning, I'll finish tomorrow.). I can apply different textures to my sliced grid. After that some GIMPing is needed, not that much.. A simple matter of resizing and recentering the canvas.
This system can give us huger chunks of tilable tiles (thats how Follout works, simply you can lay floor tiles on a map automatically and not by hand). I do agree with the fact that simple noisy tiles with a bunch of variations is a good one.
Anyway, if you want me to try please let me know.
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Sirren
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« Reply #11 on: May 12, 2009, 12:47:33 PM »

Bump.
I made a set of ice tiles, just as an experiment:
http://rapidshare.de/files/47128483/Tiles_I.rar.html
Tiles are numbered from left to right. I hope somebody can do something with these
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maximinus
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« Reply #12 on: May 12, 2009, 02:52:55 PM »

OK people, thanks for the effort so far, what I need is some extra tiles for the transition tiles. If you get the latest from SVN and look in PARPG/objects/ground/grass/transition you'll see what gfx I need, The names need to be similar but I can handle the XML files.
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bored dude
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« Reply #13 on: May 12, 2009, 03:57:09 PM »

Looks nice, bored dude. Thanks for the contribution. Help's always welcome.

One problem I see with your tiles is that they... urm... don't tile good. The repetitions are to obvious (@see attachment)

I'm not that much of a gfx guy, so maybe I'm totaly wrong and there are some tricks. Surely Sirren or one of the other guys can say more about this. Just wait until he pops in and has a look at them.

I'll look into the repitition thingy. http://petesqbsite.com/sections/tutorials/tuts/tsugumo/chapter1.htm
And how did you test it? Is there a compiled svn version I could test run with my tiles?


Amongst other stuff we'd need a tool to lay down HUGE chunks of tiles at once, provided that we want some variation. I'm talking about dirt/snow/ground tiles, not special stuff like pavements/roads you have to carefully place.
If it's simply to have a placeholder then a simple blurred blue/white tile could do.. Sorry, just a wild guess

FIFE has a basic map editor tool. How basic is it?

Couldn't you use the tile creation guide that Lamoot posted at the wiki?

http://wiki.parpg.net/Graphics:Workflow_Simple_Tile

Photoshop is faster, a lot, if you have your reference picture from the tutorial.

OK people, thanks for the effort so far, what I need is some extra tiles for the transition tiles. If you get the latest from SVN and look in PARPG/objects/ground/grass/transition you'll see what gfx I need, The names need to be similar but I can handle the XML files.

And there I thought FIFE supported stencil maps from the get go and would blend together what you put together. Now you'll have to create a good amount of transition tiles and mapping, mapping is gonna be a horror. =)
I see that there are 30 transition tiles in the trunk. So 30 stencil maps. I assume the standard ones from http://wiki.fifengine.de/Tutorial:Content:Tiles   ?
Cpt. Obvious mode:
You also obviously need a lead who is gonna decide how many tiles/transition tiles of what terrain/combo do you actually need and so on.
"I need some extra tiles for the transition tiles." - is not the way to go.
"The names need to be similar" - naming convention == less headache for the code monkey.

http://www.gamasutra.com/features/20011024/peasley_01.htm

Quote
When making a texture tile set, you'll need to create a minimum set of tiles. The complexity of the planned environment will determine the number of tiles, how well the tiles appear visually without showing repetitive patterns, and how many different types of random tiles will be required. The amount of available memory for the terrain will impact all these factors. As a good starting point, create the minimum base set, then add to it only when necessary. Reuse is king, so try to stretch your texture budget as far as possible.
« Last Edit: May 12, 2009, 04:03:20 PM by bored dude » Logged
mvBarracuda
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« Reply #14 on: May 12, 2009, 04:16:32 PM »

No precompiled version at this point but setting up the build enviroment takes about 20 minutes for the first time and after that it's simply a short 30 seconds SVN update. You won't need any programming-related knowledge to build FIFE and run PARPG. If you can run a batch file, you can build FIFE :-)

Here's the guide:
http://wiki.parpg.net/Download
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